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This journal is about adoptable-prices and, when generalized, about art-pricing on deviantART in general.
I know this is bound to raise a debate, but after what I have recently been seeing in the adoptable-community I'm tackling this topic.
If you feel you may be offended by this, then please stop reading here. That being said, I shall try to keep this journal as polite as possible.


----


First: a little question.

How many of you here have already drawn art for money (or points) or have made adoptables and sold adoptables?
If you have, then congratulations, this message is of importance of you. If you are a buyer of art / adoptables, this message is also of importance.


I've been noticing more and more comments on art of adoptables complaining about the pricing.
Luckily, I seem to not get too many of these (knock on wood), but I still find these types of comments incredibly rude when I come across them.


Mind you, there is a huge difference between:

"I love this adoptable, but unfortunately I lack the funds to buy it."
"This costs that much? You overpriced rip-off! The design isn't even worth that much!!"


The first comment is the polite way of saying you like a design, while still letting the artist know you won't be buying it. The second, however, is plain rude and should not even be posted in the comment-section of a piece of art that somebody is trying to sell. If you want to complain about the price being "outrageous": you have your own journal to do that in. Post it there, but not in the comment-section.

And honestly: how long would you wager a drawing takes an artist?
If you think $2 or 100 points for a design is overpriced, then you obviously must hold this belief that an artist only needs 10 minutes to create an entirely finished drawing, from sketch to finish. Because the minute they work as much as an hour on the drawing, they're only being paid $2 per hour, which is well below minimum wage.


Is art really worth less as a skill than flipping burgers in McDonalds?


I guess the point I'm trying to make here is that if you can't afford an adoptable or a commission, then that is indeed not fun for you.
But please don't diminish and demean an artist's art and work simply because you may not be able to afford it.

And I'll get off of my soapbox now. ; u ;
Add a Comment:
 
:iconralola:
Ralola Featured By Owner Feb 19, 2013  Student Digital Artist
I like how you think.
But lets say someone made this huge beautiful dragon, and a tiny chibi dragon with a good sum of shading on him. What would you deem a fair price for both dragons?
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hey, my apologies for the late reply.

What I would deem a fair price for the dragons is not something I can say without having seen the art, I'm afraid. That being said, if a drawing takes you 5h+ or even more, common sense dictates that you shouldn't be selling it for $1. :confused:
Reply
:iconralola:
Ralola Featured By Owner Feb 24, 2013  Student Digital Artist
Yeah true '3'
I'm just curious on your thoughts^^
Reply
:iconskittlebittle:
SkittleBittle Featured By Owner Jan 11, 2013  Hobbyist
I love you for this. :) Well, for bringing it to light.

I think people just want as much as they can get for WAY cheap or free. And they think some artists just pull it instantly out of their head an onto digital paper in mere seconds. =w=
They don't realize that they're "buying" a character that's for them to use and do as they please and not have to give credit back to the person who created it(unless the original person wishes them to do so).
...they're just whiners.

If I made as much as *Mirandarin working at McD's, oh yea I'd be happy! XD
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
I think people just want as much as they can get for WAY cheap or free.
Exactly. Which is a shame, as it devalues the price of art and the art itself in the process. :C

Honestly, I consider myself pretty lenient with my adoptables. Once it's bought, the design is there to change as they see fit. The only thing I ask is that if they repost the original image (the drawing), that they credit me. Other than that: if I've sold it, it's out of my hands. I really don't see the point in "taking back" adopts if someone uses it in a way that I may not like. = n =
Reply
:iconskittlebittle:
SkittleBittle Featured By Owner Jan 13, 2013  Hobbyist
True. If they could only "think" about the time that person took to make the adoptables as well.
Some are just naturally talented and can get them down with ease. While others take their time to make sure it's right.

Though I do love the whiners who complain to the person about the price that's set to the adoptables. Because probably make their own adopabtles that look sad and jack the price up. =D

I know one is "buying" the character, so the image shouldn't look like Picasso, but some "effort" should be put in to entice a person to want to buy it more. :)
Because I've honestly seen plenty that look like they just scribbled it down and jack the prices up. :no:
Reply
:iconmirandarin:
Mirandarin Featured By Owner Jan 4, 2013
Just wanted to point out, i work at Mcdonalds and i found it a rather harsh statement XD I earn $20 an hour as just a crew member.

But yes i do agree. I find it so hard to try and sell my HQ adoptables, cause everyone thinks they are so over priced. When they are seriously HQ work. Its ridiculous how under priced adoptables are here.
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 4, 2013
Oh my, I did not mean offence by it. It's just a pretty wide-spread comparison when talking about fair pricing. My apologies. D:

And agreed. I took a look at your adoptables and they definitely look like a lot of effort went into those. It's just a shame that some people even consider 20 points to be overpriced, let alone starting bids of 100 points, which is still ridiculously cheap.
Reply
:iconmirandarin:
Mirandarin Featured By Owner Jan 4, 2013
It completely okay. I just cop it a lot from friends and people who assume im nothing cause i work at McDonalds XD Its not like im already trying to find a better job XD

Yeah, ive tried selling adoptables for over a month, having to extend auction dates or repost the same thing multiple times to try and sell. People just dont clip on to them cause they are "so" expensive. But i recently saw an adoptable auction that finished on rough 2000 points, it was only flat coloured sketchy lines. I just don't understand XD
Reply
:iconink-jam:
Ink-Jam Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
I'm glad someone touched on this! I honestly think that adopts in general should be 20 dollars or less, mainly because you are buying a design! It's a concept more or less, but I also think artists who do this should keep designs open ended. It's not that I dont think artists should get the raw end of the deal, but adopts get tricky since many people use bases and sometimes they're not even their own base. So then its just like..while I understand you picked the colors and drew the clothing...I dont feel as though I should be spending as much on a tiny thing that isn't completely yours as a new pair of shoes.

But thats just me personally, and I know many people feel different about it, and thats okay! I guess for me I can't see why you'd spend 30 dollars on a design that might be nice, but theres nothing unique about it. (However for people to complain that a dollar to two dollars is expensive...that is a bit much.)
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
For me, it depends on the art you get and the extras you get with it.
Honestly, if it is a detailed refsheet with multiple poses I could definitely see that sell for more than $20. After all, you do buy the rights to the design, but you also get a first piece of art to go with the design.

But then, that's my personal opinion I suppose.
I just dislike seeing people underprice and still being told that they are being "rip-offs", when art in a professional environment costs so much more. ^^;
Reply
:iconink-jam:
Ink-Jam Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
Oh well yeah! I ment I've seen a single posed just free standing design that wasn't very detailed that a popular artist was trying to sell for 30 dollars, and while yes they are talented...I didn't feel that for the design it was worth it. But yeah if its a whole sheet and stuff then the value would go up!

Yes I will never understand that when prices are so very low. But you will always have people like that I'm afraid.
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
Then we are on the same page here. :nod:
And I know there will always be people like that, unfortunately, but then I'll always be there to lecture them with some common sense.
Reply
:icontinyfurrtails:
TinyFurrTails Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
First off, coming from someone who MAKES but rarely buys (and uses) adopted characters. There are some Pros and Cons for those differences in prices, both as the artist and customer. It depends why you're making the adopts.

If you're the person buying them, cheaper prices means you can either buy more, or you can start buying art of that character right away with leftover money. I'd they're more expensive you'll have to weigh how much you like the design, and if you won't have extra money you'll likely be the only one drawing art of her.

If you're the artist though, cheaper prices means that they're more likely to be bought and/or used. It depends if the person really likes the character not just on impulse. I think cheaper prices sometimes mean the person could just buy it Cus they like it but never use it. If a design is more expensive then someone who really loves the design will respect the price tag, right?

Honestly, I bought most of my adoptables on a cheap impulse and ending up regretting it relatively soon, I appreciate artists who make quality adopts expensive because it keeps me from buying things that deep down I know I shouldn't. As someone who makes adopts I've realized that even though the money rocks. It's WAY more fun to see somebody that plans to use the character :) So I'd rather have cheaper adopts that get used a lot.

too all you lovely adopt makers that have very well made adopts with a high (but appropriate) price tag. Thank you for making beautiful characters that I can appreciate from afar, and thanks for not encouraging impulsive buying
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
You definitely have some valid points. :nod:

Personally, I make adoptables to try out new colouring techniques, but also to practice designing characters. That and I make more characters than I can use, so I sell the ones I don't use.

That being said: for the time I put into the designs, I still think I'm severely undercharging because I want to make sure the adoptables stay affordable. However, striking the balance between effort and price, most of my designs end up at around 250 - 600 points, which is still "a rip-off" to some people.

And I do agree with you on the impulse-buying. I don't understand designs that go for $75 if they're just simple colored sketches. However, if that means the design won't be bought on a whim and never used again, that's not too bad either, I suppose. :confused:
Reply
:icontinyfurrtails:
TinyFurrTails Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I try out new coloring ideas as they come along so no specific outlet :) and yes! The best part if adopts is the clothing though :) that part makes me happiest. Ha, I love when I make an adoptable that I want to keep and then I finish it and don't like it anymore.

True, but technically it comes with a free commission practically! If you were just. Using the design it wouldn't have to be drawn..... So it counts as design PLUS artwork! I'm more eager to see characters get used so I trade them off ^.^

Yes impulse buying is a sad sad thing.... I don't even remember the designs I bought.... Designs sell for that much?! O.o woah. I see it as a means of controlling your market, you're more likely to get a buyer who will treat the design proper then someone who will abandon it (like me) that's why I have to resist looking at cheaper adoptables because I know what I'll do >.<
Reply
:iconmadolche:
Madolche Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
Regarding prices (this is my personal belief and not aimed towards you or any adopt makers out there)
I believe in making the adopt affordable for any type of artist / person. Some people cant afford prices like 1000:points: or $12 so why charge so much? I believe in giving everyone an equal chance at obtaining the character they want and not to be held down by funds or the fact they lack the means of obtaining the funds (maybe they find it rare to be commissioned)

So its a fair argument to say $12 is alot of money for an adopt considering all your getting is the design not the art itself. And considering how difficult it is to get money commissions nowadays people want to be sparse with their money

Again this isnt aimed at anyone this is just my personal belief.
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
Personally, I think $12 is not a lot at all, if you're getting a full CG drawing of the design.
I mean, those drawings can take up well over 7h to make and $12 still is underpricing your efforts at less than $2 per hour.

I have adoptables that I make with my own line-art and those cost less, but when it's an adoptable I draw from scratch, then the price most likely is $15 or up since I believe in charging fairly for the work I put into my art. And honestly: I know not everyone can afford to spend $12 on a design, which I don't mind since I have patience to wait for someone who can afford the design. It's mostly the "This is a rip-off!!"-comments that I have a problem with.

If someone thinks it's too expensive, they're more than free to say this in a polite way.
If they can't even do that, then they shouldn't say it at all. ^^;

Apologies for the minor wall of text. "OTL
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:iconmadolche:
Madolche Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
Its true your getting the full image free as well as an icon in some cases but.

I'm afraid the adopt community is all about gaining and not giving. I make adopts at a cheap price so people can have cute characters with a little something extra. Its true i put in alot of effort into my adopts since drawing anatomy is a difficulty for me so I can rarely draw from scratch but I ignore my hardship in making the adopt. I think of it as putting the hard work in for everyone out there. people seem to forget thats what making adopts are for.
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
But that's the thing: the design is still worth something.

And I make cheaper designs to cater to different budgets, but I do mind when someone decides they don't want to buy what's within their budget and instead choose to try and guilt-trip an artist by insulting them in hopes of getting a design cheaper or for free.

Adoptable-artists aren't obligated to design these designs, so I feel like the price they put on the work they do should be respected.
The same with commissions: if an artist puts a price on their own work that they feel comfortable with, it should be respected, instead of calling them "overpriced" and "rip-offs". ^^;
Reply
:iconmadolche:
Madolche Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
    Then ignore those people who say its a rip off I agree you put alot of work into your adopts and i respect that! Sometimes people just want a bargain i guess its human nature.

    Just keep doing what your doing and dont let them bother you.
Reply
:iconhardrockangel-adopts:
Hardrockangel-Adopts Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
Ah, the reason I wrote this is not because it happened on my own designs.
As I said, I'm lucky I don't get these kinds of comments frequently. ; u ;

It's just that when I see people do this to other artists and then these artists actually do lower the price because they were bullied into thinking that even 20 points is overpriced then ... Yeah. I will speak up. o A o

I mean, bargaining like "Hey, I love this and I was wondering if you would accept [lower price]? Thank you!".
That's friendly, that's nice and that's not what I mind. D:
Reply
:iconmadolche:
Madolche Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2013
    Oh I see, yeah that does get pretty frustrating..the best thing to do it to just let the artist do as they please, i mean they might not even mind lowering the price what if they made the adopt for the purpose of being sold, but not for a profit?
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